[quote="Robert"]If you look at the link I provided, it is from the CDC. [/quote]
and it had no statistical proof to back it up.
[quote]Again, I ask, Should children have the right to tell an adult, "please don't smoke by me, it bother me?"[/quote]
Should they have a right to say, "Don't:
wear that perfume,
eat food that makes you pass gas,
drive so fast,
make me go to grandma's - she's mean,
forgetto buy me the gift I want,
make me eat meat,
make me have to live you crazy vegetarian lifestyle,
make me have to wear a seatbelt its uncomfortable and couldcause me to drown if we go in the river,
The answer to all of these is yes, they can ask, but No they cannot demand it they are the kids.
Don't beat me and break my bones.
Don't feedme to that lion at the zoo
Dont' kill me.
Don't make me work in a sweat shop.
Yes, they have the right to be protected by those things and they are. Unless they are not yet born in the case of 3 or they live in a communist country in the case of 4.
Are you going to let people smoke around your kid Stavros? Anticipating the answer, I ask, why not?
Should kids have the right to ask not to be put in a shopping cart? 24,000 kids a year are hurt in shopping cart accidents, 49% of them require both initial treatment and follow up medical care or are admitted to the hospital.
Again Robert, if we pass this law why wouldn't we pass a law barring parents from feeding their children artificial sweetners? Or moving into a brand new house? Or exposing their children to fresh paint fumes ( with fresh being a months long period )
[quote="bonger"]If you really serious and want to stop people dying from cigarettes start a petition to out ban smoking outright!!![/quote]
The Tobacco Taliban (anti-tobacco hypocrits) make 3 times more money off each pack of cigarettes sold than the tobacco companies. They target their "anti-smoking" ads to make smoking attractive to those who want to be different. That way they can kill off people who are more likely to believe them and profit off tobacco while pretending to be great heros of health.
They would never ban it, they are worse than the tobacco companies and are making 3 times the profit with no overhead excepttheir own bloated salaries.
I'll put this another way.....
When the state owns and pays for my car including the excise tax, insurance, and car payments then the state can dictate what legal things can be done in my car. Until then, I have the right to say what legal things can be done in my car.
Because I am the parent and it is mine and nobody else's (except my wife's) choice. But I wouldn't like it if someone made a law that I couldn't eat fast food in front of my daughter because it will be more likely to make her fat and unhealthy like me. Even though that is true. It would only make me defensive of my position rather than make me want to set a good example and stop on my own. Lots of people get defensive and think that same way.
Smoking is bad and doing it around kids is wrong but backing smokers into a corner will not work on getting them to stop. It's only going to make them criminals and I don't think it rises to criminal behavior.
[quote="bonger"]When the state owns and pays for my car including the excise tax, insurance, and car payments then the state can dictate what legal things can be done in my car. [/quote]
You may have missed the law that prohibits you from consuming, or even opening an alcoholic beverage in your car, whether you intend to operate the vehicle or not.
No. I didn't miss anything. Notice I said "legal" activity. Consuming or opening a beverage in a car is illegal activity.
I realize that banning smoking in a car with children would then make that illegal, but currently it is not.
[quote="Stavros Mendros"]Smoking is bad and doing it around kids is wrong but backing smokers into a corner will not work on getting them to stop. It's only going to make them criminals and I don't think it rises to criminal behavior.[/quote]
You don't want to make laws to ban it, neither do I. You also don't want to give kids the right to tell adults not to smoke around them. So what is your answer to the problem? Tell the kids, tough crap, live with it.
Well, I don't know that there should be laws against smoking with children trapped in the same space with you...
but who in their right mind would knowingly expose their children to that? If anyone smokes in the same car with MY BABY, oh no no no no no. Hell will be paid because I'll FLIP OUT.
ps-What's the deal with brand new houses?
Robert, life isn't fair. If it was we'd all be born into rich families with no worries about accessing opportunities and the money for college education would be there no matter what. We'd all drive the car we wanted to drive since we were 16 and eat from menu's with lobster and fillet mignon and we wouldn't even have to buy it, cook it or serve it ourselves.
Life is not fair Robert.
Again, what is next after this? There is no logical reason to not extend this to other known carcinogens like artifical sweetners, paint fumes ( months ), the air on a city street.....
Where does it end Robert?
Catherine, construction materials out gas known carcinogens for months if not years. If you have environmental allergies a new home, unless it is specially constructed, is not the place you want to be. If you are concerned about exposure of children to chemicals known to cause cancer over the long term in lab rats you cannot in good conscious move them into a new home.
Thanks for the tip. Knowing that, I never will move my family or myself into a new home. I have seen too many people die of cancer.
But God forbid we wiretap terrorists because they are stealing our rights. What a mixed up country we are.
So what you are saying David, is kids do not have rights when dealing with ignorant adults? Thank God I do not take your attitude with my grandson. I teach him to stick up for himself. At 4 and a half, he has already told many an adult to not smoke around him. They shamefully comply.
My girls (4 and 5) tell Mrs. Freud that her hairspray makes the air yucky.
Well good Robert. It's glad to see you agree with Stravos and have done for your grandson just what Stravos said was the appropiate thing to do.
a whole lot of excitement over absolutely nothing.
[quote="Catherine8679"]Well, I don't know that there should be laws against smoking with children trapped in the same space with you...
but who in their right mind would knowingly expose their children to that? If anyone smokes in the same car with MY BABY, oh no no no no no. Hell will be paid because I'll FLIP OUT.[/quote]
Your car breaks down and since Baldacci was re-elected your cell phone doesn't work. It's raining and kindly old lady offers a ride to you and your child but she smokes? Do you refuse the ride, do you yeel at her if she refuses to put out the cigarette? Should it be illegal for her to give you a ride? Is government helping you by makingit illegal for her to give you a ride and let you out of the rain?
Lemme tell you something... I wouldn't get in the car with a stranger anyway, rain or no rain... especially with a BABY! Old ladies can be serial killers too.
Standing up for yourself is admireable.
Imposing your will on a downtrodden class (smokers) is not brave, its just bullying. Lots of white kids bravely told large black people to get up and move to the back of the bus. It didn't make them courageous. The courageous ones faced the rididuleof their peers, opposed the junk science claiming blacks were inferior and took the unpopular stand for what they believed to be right.
True Catherine, but serial killers wouldn't ask you to get in they would make you. And they are much more likely to come upon you when you are stranded on an abandoned road than they are when you are in a car.
Thanks for the one more thing to worry about, Stav. :lol:
Not to pick bones, but I have actually experienced very little areas where my cell phone doesn't work around here.
But, if I am going to play along with your scenario, in that situation I would probably kindly ask the lady to put out her cigarette. I would probably lie to her and tell her that my baby has athsma. If that didn't work, then I would not like it, but I would tolerate it. Why is it wrong for me to not want people smoking cigarettes around my baby? I mean, smoking around a baby certainly isn't GOOD!!! Right now the smell of cigarettes makes me violently ill.
[quote="Robert"]So what you are saying David, is kids do not have rights when dealing with ignorant adults? Thank God I do not take your attitude with my grandson. I teach him to stick up for himself. At 4 and a half, he has already told many an adult to not smoke around him. They shamefully comply.[/quote]
I was doing a job in Belfast last summer and was sitting outside on the steps having my after lunch smoke when a skinny little punk that was walking by stopped and told me that smoking was bad for my health to which I replied , so is sticking your nose where it don't belong.He replied in a whiney voice that violence never solves any thing. I replied ,oh yea,want to see violence solve this problem while standing up. He took off running and the rest of the crew was rolling on the ground laughing. Moral of the story Robert...You better teach him to fight if your gonna teach him to run his yap and stick his nose where it don't belong. :lol: :lol:
[quote="Earl Nickerson . Jr"] Moral of the story Robert...You better teach him to fight if your gonna teach him to run his yap and stick his nose where it don't belong. :lol: :lol:[/quote]
Not to worry about that Earl. He will be able to handle himself.
I also do not teach him to stick his nose in other peoples business. But If you stick your back habits in his space, he will let you know. ;)
My point was more that it shouldn't be illegal for her to help you out. In the way she chooses to as long as you are ok with it.
this is a hard one for me
its a fine line between being able to be free to do as you wish until it harms another, and protecting children
i am against smoking bans in private businesses, and i am against the government being involved in our homes...
but i don't think this violates my libertarian side, as smoking is bad for you, and second hand smoke that you are enclosed in, is bad, so it violates anothers rights, therefore you have to give up yours
i hate people who smoke in the car with kids...
i think this does not violate my small government side... its protecting children...
Oh,as long as "It's For The Children". :roll: That trumps everthing..... I think we've gone WAY overboard on protecting kids. It's a wonder we all made it with no helmets,knee pads,cig smoke EVERYWHERE, tag , football, dodgeball, getting dirty , house not disinfected,toys that weren't clean.I can't believe we're all still alive..... :roll:
Earl, I agree with you, but there's a difference between overprotection, and the government getting in the way of parents, and Parents who knowingly harm their children
you wouldn't disagree with laws protecting kids from being beaten, or left to starve would you?
I'm not saying parents can't smoke, but man, do it in the outdoors, after you get where you are going, or make a stop if you need one...
HUH???I didn't realize smoking was as bad as beating or starving kids.I think that may have been illegal when I was a kid... :roll: And who the hell are you to tell me what to do in MY HOME OR CAR. Smokers today,Tommorow it will be illegal to give kids food that are "Not Approved" or home inspections to be SURE kids are SAFE.... God,you nanny do gooders need to get a life or a hobby....
[quote="Earl Nickerson . Jr"]HUH???I didn't realize smoking was as bad as beating or starving kids.I think that may have been illegal when I was a kid... :roll: And who the hell are you to tell me what to do in MY HOME OR CAR. Smokers today,Tommorow it will be illegal to give kids food that are "Not Approved" or home inspections to be SURE kids are SAFE.... God,you nanny do gooders need to get a life or a hobby....[/quote]
and i cant stop laughing from your above story about having a smoke on your lunchbreak ............lol :lol: :lol: